'AITA for telling my brother to stop bringing his daughter to our trips?'
"AITA for telling my brother to stop bringing his daughter to our trips?"
I have three brothers and we are all married with kids. Our lives are very busy so we don't see each other much which is why twice a year we all go on a fishing trip together and bring some of our kids with us.
This is a tradition we've had for more than a decade now, and the kids we bring are those interested, which ended up being just our sons, except for my brother James and his daughter Selene (17F).
She was way more interested in fishing than James's other kids were, and he's been bringing her since we started the tradition. It was all cool and dandy when all of our kids were children, but now that they are all teens and older, with the youngest being 15, it kind of got awkward.
During our recent trip, my son (15M) as well as one of my nephews (16M) came to me and my eldest brother and asked us if it was possible to not have Selene come on the next trip with us because they would like to have a father-son trip with just us, since they can't really speak freely or behave how they want because it feels weird having her there.
I understood where they were coming from, since most of them are in that awkward phase and having a girl present when you just want to rowdy with your cousins can feel very weird, so I discussed it with my eldest brother and we decided to ask James if it was possible for him to not bring Selene on the next trip, and bring another one of his kids instead so we could have a father-son vacation.
James did not take this well at all, and said he will simply not be coming even though we explained our reasoning very well to him and I had my son and nephew tell him how they felt so he could see their perspective.
My oldest nephew heard what happened and he made an over-sensationalized post on facebook calling us dinosaurs, so the story got out to the rest of the family, and opinions are split, however those that think I'm in the wrong REALLY think I'm in the wrong and have not been shy about expressing it.
I just wanted to listen to my son and nephew and give them the experience they wanted and not dismiss their feelings and make them feel heard. But now I'm second-guessing. AITA.
Let's see what internet users had to say.
czandra writes:
Yta. Why are the boys feelings more important than the girls? Why is it ok to reject her from a family tradition? You don't seem to see HER perspective...she's getting the boot because she's a girl. ONLY because she's a girl. And her cousin's and uncles, who she THINKS love her, are the ones pushing her out.
As father's and teachers of young men, you should have used this to show kindness, fairness, and respect for women. Instead you backed them up. Shame on you all.
Their feelings are not more important, individually they are all equal in my eyes. It is just that there are more of them, as my eldest brother and I assumed that the sentiment my son and nephew expressed was also held by my other nephews who come onto the trip. So it's a matter of the many vs one. We all love Selene, and think she is a a very smart and kind girl, this was never in question.
I know see that this is not the case maybe, as some of my nephews are very upset at me and so is my youngest brother, so we will be re-discussing this when James is more willing to talk to us.
willyd0 writes:
YTA. If there's something you or your brother want to say or do that you feel is inappropriate to say or do in front of a girl, then it's equally inappropriate to say or do it in front of your male children. It's probably inappropriate to say or do it at all.
You're also teaching your son and nephew to exclude girls, that girls are a killjoys who put a damper on 'real fun', and that it's perfectly OK to do or say whatever misogynistic BS you had planned.
You may not believe this is true, but you're exhibiting misogyny and you're teaching misogyny to your kids.
remoteranger writes:
YTA. You have the exact degenerative mindset of “boys will be boys”. What do you mean “cant speak freely”, what cant be said around specifically a girl? Of course unless you mean they want to talk about a girl in such a derogatory way which makes it even worse.
The tradition was doing well with no problems. Maybe teach the young boys how to act like REAL good hearted men, rather than the “women are objects and we cant be derogatory or say want we want anymore” men. God help yall.
[deleted]
YTA. If your son and nephew want farther son trips then take them on farther son trips, you don’t get trample over your brother and niece to get what you want because you can’t “speak freely” around her (already says enough about what you all wanna act/ talk like)
You state his other kids aren’t that interested in going so why try and rope them into it and make everyone miserable in the process
By speaking freely, they just wanted to be able to discuss their prospective dating life/how to approach girls and talk to them at high school/ the changes they are going through because of puberty, and they felt weird speaking about any of this in front of Selene.